Hazel Chem - 2020-06-18
Hello, you all this video is a quick update on the plastic waste to fuel pyrolysis project A big thanks to Heidolph for sponsoring the rotational evaporator !! Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/hazelchem Instagramm: https://www.instagram.com/hazelchem/?hl=de
How did you make the fractionating column?
Great stuff this! I'm currently playing with py-oil from biomass with the goal of extracting wood vinegar, also known as liquid smoke.
My reactor is made from a stainless steel soda keg and is housed inside a beer keg wrapped in rockwool. It's heated by a TLUD gasifier that produces biochar so it's nett carbon negative.
During the past years I've build similar units; learning, like you, from problems with previous ones to improve the new ones. I use pyrolysis for many different purposes; among these, converting useless non-recyclable and thereby unsellable fractions of plastic waste to fuel; including all kinds of dirty and contaminated plastic types.
Some subjects regarding your pyrolysis reactor project:
"You're changing the gas seal every time you're filling the reactor chamber" I watched you using sealant rope on a previous reactor. Ceramic sealant rope is less expensive; also, top quality brands can be used several times. Notice, you should always cut the rope in a 25 degree angle, then you let the long ends overlap and just twist the very outer ends to create a nearly self locking sealer ring with almost the same diameter all around. Even better if you use the right heat resistant glue made for ceramic rope; then you don't twist the ends and the connection will barely be visible.
"You're using expensive steel tube flanges on top of the reaction chamber". An inexpensive way of making flanges for connecting the unit parts is going to a local scrap yard and buy some disc brakes from old cars, or perhaps getting them for free at auto repair shops. Put a disc brake in a lathe, square it off on both sides, cut a recess for the ceramic sealing on the side facing out, make the hole in the middle as large as possible, then cut off all unneccessary material. Disc brakes are made of cast iron, thus they will not bend or twist under high heat.
"You have a complicated system of connecting the flanges with loose bolts+nuts". Make the lower flange 10 -12 mm thick and the upper one 5 - 6 mm. Avoid any loose bolts+nuts. You can cut threadings into the lower flange so you can place a heavy upper part on the heating chamber, align it with the holes, and screw the bolts in place. If you don't wanna cut threadings you can weld the nuts on the underside of the flange. This, however, requires more space on the neck of the heating chamber; it's more convenient to keep everything as low as possible. Alternatively, cut off the bolt heads, place the shortened bolts, facing the cut ends downwards, into the holes in the flange, almost flush with the underside though raised 1 mm, and weld them in place. This way you use the nuts to tighten the system, but it really only works well with a light upper part. With a heavy upper part there's a serious risk of damaging the bolt threadings when trying to place the upper part correct. Anyhow, now you only need one piece of tool for tightening the bolts, and you can do it with only one hand. By the way, 6 to 8 bolts are recommended for proper equal tension on the gas seal. Actually, larger units mostly have 24 to 48 bolts!
"Your whole reaction chamber is inside the fire chamber". That's bad for the sealing. A pro-unit is always constructed in such a way that the top of the reaction chamber protrudes from the fire chamber; this prolongs the life of the sealing significantly. By letting the reaction chamber hang from the top of the fire chamber enables the heat to be more intensive on the bottom of the chamber, right where the heavy tar and carbon black is, thus thorough pyrolysis is achieved in each batch. No need for a thick steel plate on the bottom; it just prevents some of the heat from penetrating into material to be processed. Pro-units always have a pyrolysis chamber with a round bottom or slightly rounded bottom; never flat.
hello thank you for the informative comment ! :D I will look into your point and try to implement them
mfg hazelChem
I like your ideas. You should use an epoxy to glue your lids together, something like JB weld will do the job, I assume the addition of the metal dust in the mix helps, besides its cheap and easy to come by. I've repaired a diesel engine injector seat with some of that and over 40k miles later it's still not leaking!
I did some high temperature vessels (to burn small quantities of plastic) with stainless steel cups/caps/tubes found on kitchenware store and sealed the joints with exhaust pipe sealer (is a paste that solidifies and resist high temperatures sold in auto parts store)
Well I also had the exact same problem of glue failing due to temperatures and/or chemicals and what worked for me was wrapping the tube with teflon tape numerous times(so that it looks way to thick for the hole) and then force it into the hole. Thats also, how my cooling water Pump was working for over two years😂
A 1/8" bulkhead fitting with a jubilee to keep the pipe on would sort you out on the cheap and as a perfect long term fitting. Used for high pressure high temp hydrolics and cheap
Perhaps you can use either copper/brass compression fittings intended for plumbing. Compression fittings will handle pressure and also not require solder which could melt at high temperature. Otherwise you could use standard push hose fittings and hose clamps (https://www.mcmaster.com/tube-fittings/hose-and-hose-fittings/)
Use RTV high temp silicone, used in wood stove manufacturing of Rutland cement! Or a more simple under drill the hole for your tubing by 1/8" or 3.175 MM creating a compression fitting!
Hello! I saw your video on how to build the combustion chamber, I thought that the first layer of refractory cement did not last long, do you think it is a good idea to add steel wool to the cement?
well that could lead to burning metal in your cement. I would go with ceramic fiber for a composite
mfg hazelChem
@Hazel Chem Thanks for your response and for your work. In your first pyrolytic reactor video you talked about using the gases produced by pyrolysis to feed the combustion chamber, is it possible to do? or is the flame too weak?
High-temp silicone!
Just remembered, there's a type of silicone made specifically for high temperatures.
Example: This version takes up to 250 ℃.
https://www.biltema.se/bygg/kemikalier/silikon/silikon-hogtemperatur-2000017141
If you can modify destination part by using resistor or cool by water, also keep distance distillation part from reactor chamber using strong metal pipe, it may more safety and better result.
As for the glue fix. Id recommend a mason jar with a copper pipe soldered through the airtight top.
Can you put the exhaust gas back through to use to heat it more rather then burn it and waste it. It will save you a little bit of gas. Great job x
I'm very excited man!!! Looks incredible
"HG Power Glue: Schweissnaht aus der Flasche" Chemically resistant also against Diesel Petrol. Working temprature -45°C to 110°C. Glues pretty everything but brickwork, felt, styrofoam, teflon, silicone and palstics that have waxes e.g PP PE
Awesome bro , i've been following your work and i am grateful for your updates. consider setting up a patreon . thanks
hey thanks for your positive feedback! I already have a patreon account if you like to support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/hazelchem
mfg hazelChem
Maybe chauling agents required for fire place stoves I am not sure it will work but it may. Could be better than using glue.
I think the high temperature car exhaust cement is sand and sodium silicate so if there are any acids present ie: naphthalenic acid they might react with the sodium silicate.
Another option is replacing the plastic with stainless steel on the high boiling outputs.it won't cost too much to do if you're only having problems with one of your outputs.a steel tube welded to a steel water bottle would work
What about cast metal?
Investment casting, using wax & plaster, could be used to cast a metal cap that should fit the bottle's threads.
An inclusion casting, which is where you place an object within a mould and cast around it, could let you place metal pipes into that metal cap. Just remember to rough up the surface of the meal pipes before casting, for better bonding. Not pretty, but cheap. Might work.
well the problem with that would be that you have metal on glass and that normally ends in breakage.
mfg hazelChem
@Hazel Chem How about a self-clamping seal?
You take a plastic cap that fits your flasks, and make a hole in it as wide as the inside diameter of the flask's neck.
Then, using the method above, or any other method you prefer, you make a metal disc with the outer diameter equivalent to the inside diameter of the cap's threads as described above. This metal disc needs to have the metal tubes you want.
Finally, you get two gaskets. One of the gaskets go between the glass flask and the metal disc. The second goes between the metal disc and the cap. When you screw the cap on the flask, the metal disc & gaskets get squeezed between the bottle and the cap. With some silicone grease, this creates a gas tight seal without requiring any bonding and no metal on glass contact.
Regarding the glue: Based on the information, I´d recommend JB weld.
I have some I don´t need and I have written you an eMail.
Alles Gute!
I was thinking the same thing!
JB weld does not adhere to polyethylene or polypropylene. Even the JB PlasticWeld peels right off.
I think you could get a passable bond by roughing up the surface with coarse sandpaper before applying JB Weld, but it still would be pretty weak.
GREAT VIDEO..........Probably not good enough but some types of "JB WELD" (an epoxide) can take constant temps of 260 C and a maximum temp of 316 C for ten minutes
I would make that hottest fraction go to a metal container (and tube). Experiment with common drink bottles on the market. Use a mechanical method to hold it. You might do an initial pyrol, and then a secondary operation for fractional pyrol. That's what i was heading off to do. For fractional, i was going to use a fire extinguisher(aluminum vessel) sitting in sand in another pot. From the top of the vessel i was going to run a 1" diameter SS tube up about 1-2 feet using washers to divide the internal spaces and broken beer bottle glass as the packing.
sounds interesting but this approach needs a second heating and that is what i try to prevent
mfg hazelChem
@Hazel Chem Think in terms of washers inside and or outside a metal tube. SS welded, or held by those screw bands for proto typing. Like cooling fins along the stack. IDK. bouncing idea's.
Use red rtv silicone for highest boiling fraction
Thank you very much for this video! Very informative!
I don't think you'll get a glue that works on polyethylene at high temperatures. You should probably look into a way to get the two mechanically locked.
This is called a "bulkhead fitting". You just drill a hole through the cap, and it stays in place with a nut.
Example: Swagelok SS-400-61BT
(There's probably far cheaper elsewhere though).
Alternatively, if you drilled extra holes in the cap, you could put epoxy on both sides to keep the tube in place. This way, the two mounds of epoxy glue are mechanically linked to each other through the cap. It would be super-janky, but could work
awesome video, can't wait for more!!
Hi! (TL;DR at the bottom.) Ich bin gerade erst auf Deinen Kanal gestoßen, großes Lob! Noch habe ich nicht alle Videos durch, aber falls das Problem mit den Schlauchanschlüssen noch aktuell ist: Wäre es denkbar, sich einfach eine Verschlusskappe mit passendem Stutzen/Anschluss-Olive per 3D Druck zu drucken? Ob jetzt PLA, PETG oder ABS das richtige Material wäre, kann ich nicht beurteilen, da weißt Du besser, wie Reaktivität und Temperatur sind. Dann noch eine Dichtung aus PTFE rein, das könnte doch klappen? Ich habe mir hier schon aus PLA Gewinde gedruckt, die an einem normalen Wasseranschluss dicht waren und den Druck von 2-X bar locker mitgemacht haben (und PLA ist ja nicht so stabil). Wie gesagt, was die Temperatur angeht, müsste man schauen, aber da gibt's ja auch pfiffige Filamente... Nebenbei: Darf ich neugierig fragen, an welche Uni Du deinen BA machst? Ich arbeite an einer, wenn auch nicht in den NatWiss.
TL;DR: Maybe 3D printing a suitable bottle cap with connectors, either with ABS or PETG or carbon filament OR a fancy SLA-resin, could be a relatively cheap solution? Even if the caps don't last long, a new print is easy...
You could use mason jars with metal lids. Then a hose barb and clamp. About $10 a jar
My recommendation for this material problem: use marmalade or other glas jars with metal lids and glue your brass or copper hoses into it by using high temp black silicone ( https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B0078U8HN2 ). The benefit of this setup is a very high temperature resistance combined with cheap materials. I tried this with my wood gasifier directly at the outlet of the hot gas where temps are around 350-400 °C. Works like a charm.
HI have you tried seperating the feedstocks and check if you will get the same results as last time, just thinking it might give you cleaner pyrolysis oil? Most companies that sell pyrolysis machines often state to limit the feedstock to PE, PP and PS.
the problem with limiting your feed is that such a feed should be recycled by separating and reusing
mfg hazelChem
@Hazel Chem Oh but if PE PP PS are the feedstock do you still have to do the de acidifying process that you just did with your last vid?
don't bother with glue, go to the welding department of your local college and have them tig weld a stainless connector into a stainless cap
then you just slip the tubes onto the connectors, if stainless is too much investment, you can try using copper and either solder or braze it yourself
Thank for sharing all these intresting informations.Why did you put stainless steel wool inside the reactor?Is it the same we use for cleaning?
the steel wool is used as column packing. and yes you can use the same as for cleaning.
mfg hazelChem
While working on helicopters I used a material called RTV silicon if you can find a cheaper “high temp” version I’m sure it would work.
thanks for the comment sadly when i try to open the link it reads: You don't have permission to access "http://www.homedepot.com/p/Permatex-3-oz-High-Temp-Red-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker-75152/302774959" on this server.
Reference #18.8fbe1402.1592485194.d033446
mfg hazelChem
@Hazel Chem Try running this keyword search through google: "Permatex 3 oz. High-Temp Red RTV Silicone Gasket Maker". I'm guessing that Home Depot doesn't exist in your country but there might be other sources of this product. I love what you're doing here, I've always been curious about plastic pyrolysis but I don't know enough about plastic to reliably not kill myself.
Thanks @Luca LaFontaine ! Sorry didn’t realize you couldn’t open it up.
To explain what it does, by no means trying to insult your intelligence, it’s literally call Room Temp Vulcanizing. that means it will cure at room temp. If you use this use like a popsicle stick, dip the stick in alcohol before applying the silicon, it will keep it from being messy. Help you make the application site look professional too. Lol
RTV sealant. That was going to be my suggestion.
Don't use glue. Modify your still in such that your hottest distillate runs through a borosilicate cooling apparatus and into borosilicate containers or if you do use glue, cool the hottest distillate after it has separated, but before it reaches the collector. Idk how viable copper tubing is, but a coiled copper pipe running through a water bath/shower could also aid in reducing the temperature of the product. You might also connect pipes of similar material in nature to your reactor vessel's material and then fasten those pipes to a metal fitting on a receiver that's modified with a burp valve for gas exchange. Would any of these methods succeed? I'm very interested in your work.
Can you make a video on how to make fractionating column
How about silicon sealents?
Try using a steel pipe union for quick disconnecting.
"JB Weld" ist ein Hochtemperatur 2-Komponentenkleber, den ich für Hotends bis 280 °C Dauerbelastung einsetze. Ich gehe davon aus, dass der Kleber auch "Lösungsmittel"-fest ist.
Does the furnace have a
fireplace?
Why not show better pictures of the column? I agree with other comments suggesting threaded barbed fittings.
Isn't glassware an option instead of using PE caps and glue? Or maybe metal collection vessels?
only glas would cost around 200-300€ so not really
mfg hazelChem
@Hazel Chem Are you tied to the types of collection vessels you use now for any step later on in the process?
Is the reactor vessel made of stainless steel?
I tried doing this experiment with a pressure cooker, as you can imagine it didn't go very well (don't worry, i did it in open air, with a gas mask and very very far from civilization).
I want to build a similar reactor to yours but stainless steel is extremely expensive and I would be more keen to build it out of something cheaper without a risk of corrosion.
no normal building steel but it has 5 mm wall thickness and a heat resistant painting
mfg hazelChem
Hello, in my opinion you would have to use a male thread outlet adapter with a female thread and termination in a hose connector, I don't know if it is obtained in a plastic material but if it is obtained in bronze since it is used in small gas connections,I hope the message is understood since I used the google translator, I hope to be of help, greetings friend.
It's not going to be a glue but have you tried a potter glaze. Mixed with you glue. Most potter glazes are liquid glass.
man könnte auch edelstahlrohre nehmen oder so ne art woulffsche flasche bauen so das kein gas entweichen kann, falls es ein kleber sein muss vielleicht hochtemperatur silikon ausprobieren der dürfte gegen das meiste beständig sein und zudem die hitze aushalten
I’d say a bit of high temp JB Weld
Too poor to buy a proper lid, but rich enough to have a new rotovap. Holy shit.
red RTV silicone is that great high temperature sealant or gasket material automotive store or Red Devil silicone HVAC
Hazel Chem - 2020-06-18
Hello, you all this video is a quick update on the pyrolysis project. In the background you will se me working with the new reactor while I explain what’s been going on.
So due to corona crisis I had a little time to spare to work on the pyroysis project … so I build a brand-new rector. And so far I can tell you it is amazing! Each and every time I am building a new one I learn from the problems the previous had. So, for example my last reactor was just to big to handle alone. Everything was very heavy, and it took around one and a half hours to get it setup for a run. The new one has a volume of 14 liters compared to the previous 47 liters. It also has a fractional column that is filled with stainless steal wool and has outlets for different fractions. This will greatly decrease the amount of work I have to put in each clean up and analysis by already yielding a very heavy a medium low and an ultra-low boiling fraction.
With this new setup I will be able to run multiple test a day with different waste combinations and then determine the crude composition of the produced oil. I also got a brand-new rotational evaporator that was kindly sponsored to me by the company heidolph which allows me to use the pump of the old one as an accurate vacuum source. With such an accurate vacuum I will now be able do distill and analyze the ultra-high boiling paraffine fractions of my pyrolysis oil.
But this wouldn’t be a part of the build your own pyrolysis reactor series if there weren’t any problems. One of them is my bachelor that needs a lot of time and the other is high temperatures and gluing polyethylene. So, the caps I need are called gl45 and those with a hose adapter are really expensive that is why a made them myself. But as it turns out most glues can’t glue polyethylene and those who can can’t handle the high temperature of the highest boiling fraction which leads to material failure. And if that happens, I have to shut down the whole system. So till now I am trying to find a glue which can handle the temperatures and that is affordable for a student. So here is were your my viewers can help me out! I need your experience and expertise if you have already work with a material that could work write me a comment and together as a community, we will overcome this problem.
If you like what I am doing, consider supporting me via patreon so I can buy more equipment and keep working on the pyrolysis series. And if you liked the video leave a like and subscribe to my cannel. The next video will be on how I build the new reactor.
Soo have fun and do not kill yourself
hemanth chinni - 2020-07-26
When will be the video is upload
Adi Olteanu - 2020-12-18
The plastic/rubber hose is a bad idea too for temperature and if the extract is acid /basic
But... At least is cheap and you can see through it
.......
Ideea!!
Glass bottle /very large glass bottle + the rubber hose is immersed in the bottle 5 cm (max) + the cap of the bootle made with the glue gun and some paraffin/wax paper (so that the glue doesn't stik to the bottle entrance)...resulting a almost perfect seal and it's you can use it many times
Paul Davey - 2021-02-01
Hey. why do you not think to thread the four holes on the main column, thereby eliminating your need of nuts and having to use two spanners? Also would it be too much to consider using a mechanics air socket gun? <-- I don't know if that's the right words :)
MrMidnight - 2021-02-19
You could make metal bottles with an valve to get out samples during the process or you could weld metal tubes in to a metal discs with the same diameter like the bottle neck, make a hole in the bottle cap and use it like the expensive ones (maybe use PTFE tubing).
Matt Parker - 2021-03-02
I've just gotten into the subject, but I have access to a large quantity of 'heart of pine' or fatwood, or lighterd, and I was wondering what kinds of yields would you get from that material?