> elec > electromech > diy-brushless-axial-motor-ilusys-systems > diy-bldc-axial-motor-multipole-flat-coil-test-ilusys-systems

DIY BLDC Axial motor - multipole flat coil test

Ilusys Systems - 2017-05-19

Test of coil that is very simple to manufacture for use in axial motors
Watch 3 phase version of this coil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvxFdLKZU-8
Measuring efficiency: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwShvqoZX_c
Entire playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLyzlj5IaDE0fsTsjA6JsrlD7aiknbGU9K
Sample drawing:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BxYcrZZwfNmmZzM1UW5NcFZjVGM?resourcekey=0-yjOYJDHzMveKdFWUzb-ZvQ&usp=sharing

I AM Slade - 2021-12-23

Thank you for your work and for making these videos, you helped me a lot. I have just started with the axial flux motor. I have built a couple of different ones but this is very cool.

Only Me - 2021-06-09

How many copper strands did you use? And does how many strands affect torque and rpm? What voltage was you running it on? Excellent work!

Poptart McJelly - 2020-12-27

This kind of reminds me a bit of that time i made a BLDC driver for DVD spindle motors and spun them so fast that the bushings welded to the shaft. No amount of lubrication would save them. :D
In then end my power supply didn't have enough power to make the motors spin even faster but the speeds were absolutely ridiculous and the gyroscopic effects were as well.

robert williams - 2019-04-17

Thank you for the video! I was able to recreate it very easily!

Cristian Gomez - 2019-10-19

That's incredible
How is the circuit to which the coil is connected? And about how many turns does the coil have?

Snehan Shourya - 2019-05-08

Some designs use more magnets than coils, but in your design, there are equal number of magnets (magnets align perfectly with wires). How do you decide how many magnets to be put in rotor?

The A Holio - 2017-06-13

how good do these coils work compared to regular builds? I'm thinking of making a generator using this coil type.

Ilusys Systems - 2017-06-13

it depends on what the regular build is :)

typical commercial motors have 90-99% efficiency if used right.
i guess, that worst case for commercial BLDC motors used in RC community would be 60-80% if abused, but not really hard...
in my last test this motor had 45% efficiency.

to improve this, you can add more phases, or use more dense configuration of magnets (thinner bar magnets), or pulse the power only when it is most efficient(reduces power).

axial motors are compromise between power density and efficiency, but design is very simple and low cost.

I don't think this would be cost efficient generator in long run. for experiments it's pretty OK

Growley M - 2017-08-04

Okay, I see how the single coil can function as several coils with the polarity reversed from one loop to the next. What I don't see is how commutation is achieved. The motor should cog to a stop immediately, if DC is simply applied directly to the coil. I must be missing something here.

I can also see why it is not very efficient, in terms of watts in / watts out, but if light weight is more important than efficiency of energy conversion, it is ingenious. Nice work.

Ilusys Systems - 2017-08-05

Hi, commutation is done by PC fan. So this is AC motor.

You can look at my playlist if you are interested.
Driver is explained a little bit in first video of this series.
And in last video I have more efficient 3 phase version driven by RC plane motor controller

Yunior Prades - 2022-09-20

Great i have a similar design like this one i did it couse it is tge way earth works 👏👏🤝

Robert Harris - 2019-05-17

Dude you are hysterical! I use the exact same method as you. I just wing it! You literally had me laughing out loud!

TSUA - 2017-06-14

Really cool! What did you use for a power supply? Also where could we find that template?

Graze - 2017-07-23

Ilusys Systems does the system heat up from such a high wattage through such thin coils because i can only put like 3v 15 milli amps through such thin coils it melted after a few minutes

Ilusys Systems - 2017-07-23

Wow. There is no way such low power would melt hardly any plastic piece bigger than quarter coin.
3V * 0.015A = cca 1/20W. Imagine size of 1/4W resistor...

I am using 0.5mm dia. wire. I wouldn't call it thin. It can handle probably 10A @ 12V with some self cooling continuously say at 1000RPM - obviously the more RPMs, the better cooling if you don't use independent cooling.

Maybe you are measuring something wrong(meter range in mA while probe in 10A hole)?

Also I would recommend building 3phase version of this motor @ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvxFdLKZU-8

Graze - 2017-07-23

Ilusys Systems my meter is old ill go get a new one soon. and the wire i use is so thin it melts with a heat radiated off of a lighter i do all kinds of crazy things on my channel

Ilusys Systems - 2017-07-23

yeah, that's thin :)
with thin wire it's best to use high voltage and low current. but you also have to make a lot of more turns

 anyway, wish you good luck :)

Graze - 2017-07-23

Ilusys Systems ok thanks for the advice also i subed

Bingo Sun Noon - 2021-10-17

Air core motors are easy. Iron cores are powerful. Cogging and eddy currents figure in too. Your video is amusing. Good work.

Chandan Indalkar - 2019-05-23

Can someone tell me what will happen if I increase the number of winding in 3 phase generator's stator...
How will it affect the output, will the output voltage, power increase?

Ilusys Systems - 2019-05-23

Increase of number of turns means more voltage.

Increase of wire dia means more Amps.
Increase of weight of copper means more power.

Юра Гра - 2021-06-19

Молодец, настоящий брашлес

JaimeHHR HR - 2020-10-17

Isn't more energy generated by putting induced by both sides of the magnets?

Ilusys Systems - 2020-10-18

Energy isn't generated :) I guess you meant power density - in that case you can do that, but it is easier for me to close magnetic field by having 2 plates with magnets.

Lena Intha - 2019-02-17

What kind of magnets did you use?

Ilusys Systems - 2019-02-17

I believe it was neo 18x3 mm as I got good deal on this size. The thiccer the better :)

Андрей Прозрачный - 2018-11-29

Ему бы еще геркону или датчик холла для запуска и увеличения кпд.

Ashwin CEO - 2021-12-26

What controller or amplifier you are using ?Does you directly give 12 volt supply to the coil

Ilusys Systems - 2021-12-26

It's simple H bridge with hall sensor, there are more details in later videos I made

Okoye Chinedu Innocent - 2018-07-07

good works on your bldc multiple flat coil do you used bldc controller

Lean Java Bean - 2019-02-15

What kind of mold did you use for the epoxy?

Ilusys Systems - 2019-02-15

Molds are quite problematic... I tend to use random circular objects wrapped with tape around, and use hot melt glue to copy circle. Not great though...
In this case I may used a pvc hose + hot melt glue

Lean Java Bean - 2019-02-15

@Ilusys Systems That's a good way of doing it, I'm kind of new to motors but I was wondering what you connected the two copper wires to for the output?

Lean Java Bean - 2019-02-15

Wait nevermind I see now, thanks man

curt okay - 2022-04-06

I am curious about the magnet layout is it + - + - + - +

faruk kose - 2019-02-16

how many mm copper wire did you use

Ilusys Systems - 2019-02-16

in this case about 0.3mm
With PWM driver I used 0.75mm wire and ~12 turns.

Ahmed Shaikhani - 2021-08-06

Can this thing be used as a Brake for wind turbine through a PCB to slow down magnet rotor spin when winds are blowing at high speed ? PCB can be programmed in such a way to activate voltage when high wind is detected through a wind sensor ?

Mintu Doku - 2019-04-06

What power do you give..... .. i mean home electric...or..... from battery.... i mean dc or ac... this is my second comment.. coj i am interest in this....... the winding pattern is easy........ for begginners

Ilusys Systems - 2019-04-06

~250W power supplied by ATX PC PSU @12V
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAFDX301Qrk for driver (3-phase). this motor is single phase, which is not that great

rasheed khan - 2019-05-05

nice video friend......1st of all sorry for my broken english writing,,,,anyways i m new in this field,want to know abt dat i have a berger lahr stepper motor,as i turn it with finger shows near abt dc 5.00 and ac 200 ,,,,,,,,cos i cant read the current value of the motor ....can i use it for a small wind turbine???but as attach it with some load its get very hard to turn......thanx any suggestions

Ilusys Systems - 2019-05-05

Hi, that is the nature of all motors/generators. When you apply load, you have to provide more curent / when you need more current, you need to provide more force.


Personally I would not use stepper as it tends to create huge voltage at lower current normally - it would be beneficial to charge some 30V battery and then step down to provide higher currents.


it also has holding force, that you have to overcome to start not quite smooth rotation. when rotation is not smooth, this holding force will play effect here. You also can not get rid of it, because it is a result of motor construction.

Dmitriy Lapygin - 2019-12-25

Merry christmas! This is single phase motor? Can it be self - starting? This is sensorless design or with hall type sensor? I want to use same type of design to direct drive of turntable for my LP records. in i need slow speed rotation 33 1/3 rpm with high stability. Sorry my bad English

Ilusys Systems - 2019-12-26

in 3 phase design you can use rc style driver, that would work. i have made 3phase version with this coil so you can have a look on that

Lean Java Bean - 2019-02-26

I tried to make my own but for some reason it is not producing electricity when I spin it, I'm thinking it's the positive and negative wire, how do you connect them? I'm new to electronics

Ilusys Systems - 2019-02-26

This is synchronous AC motor. this means that when run as generator it will output AC (alternating current) at a frequency directly proportional to rotor speed.
Either switch your meter to AC or use full bridge rectifier with 1-phase generator.

Lean Java Bean - 2019-02-26

@Ilusys Systems ahh i was going to use it as a water generator, but to store the energy in a battery I would have to convert this to dc with a rectifier?

Ilusys Systems - 2019-02-26

Short answer: yes.

Less short: Diodes and rectifiers do have a voltage drop (0.8 - 0.5V) that will result in small, but power loss.
Using schottky diodes you can achieve smaller voltage drop (~0.1V).
Using motor driver in breaking mode can result in even lower voltage drop, but will require rather complex electronics, that increases cost and consumes some power themselves.

Happy Time - 2019-04-23

👍👍

Prince Mulbah - 2022-02-24

Can this motor also work as generator

Ilusys Systems - 2022-02-24

Sure, all motors can.

土肥六実 - 2019-10-18

Nice to meet you
My name is Rokumi Toi from Osaka, Japan.
I want to make a motor and see how many times the coil is wound?
I would appreciate it if you could tell me.

Okoye Chinedu Innocent - 2018-07-07

good works on your bldc multiple flat coil do you used bldc controller

Ilusys Systems - 2018-07-07

this is 1 phase motor, so the driver is like CPU fan driver, just powerful.

satoshi krab - 2017-10-16

cool !!!

Tim - 2018-11-09

nice design. would it be better with some metal or ferite cores?

Ilusys Systems - 2018-11-10

@Tim ferrite may help, but you generally want highest possible permeability.

Shivarajapathy S - 2018-11-20

@Ilusys Systems oi

Keith Reynolds - 2019-04-05

@Ilusys Systems You may want to see the bldc motor i built. I used iron (steel banding) in my stator to reduce the number of turns on my coils. This allowed me to have a very thin and flat arangement of three coils in my stator.

My motor is an axial flux bldc motor, with a slotless iron core,
Judging by sound, my motor has very little torque ripple. But in all fairness the motor uses 3 phase but my stator's iron, being slotless, does not cause iron "cogging" jerking.

Just turning it on the motor controller at its lowest setting, causes my motor to spin at about 1800 rpm when fed 1.49vac.

Ilusys Systems - 2019-04-05

@Keith Reynolds also got 3-phase build, was thinking about using iron filings as epoxy filler - may be interesting

Keith Reynolds - 2019-04-05

@Ilusys Systems i had considered the same thing. But wondered about using nono sized magnetite (fe3o4) for their superparamagnetic/low coercivity properties.

I built an electrolizer with iron electrodes. I used sodium chloride as the electrolyte. And made my own magnetic stirrer from a cpu fan with magnets attached and a computer power supply for power. Then for my stir bar, i used milk jugs pieces (hdpe) melted in my oven inside a soup can. I dropped in a piece of iron and more hdpe. After that was melted i pulled it out of my oven, let it cool, and cut away a lot of the excess hdpe till i had a nice stir bar. Stirring is suppose to keep the particles from aggregating into bigger ones.

I was able to make something that looked like magnetite (black and atrqcted to magnets), but i think i was unable to remove the all the salts because next day it look lik rust red mud. Probably fe2o3. I will revisit this one day.

Neill Coetzer - 2020-12-31

Could you run this in reverse for electrical generation? If so what would be the efficiency

Ilusys Systems - 2020-12-31

@Neill Coetzer Yes you can stack rotors with this system, which is quite nice.
No need for fancy switching or anything like that really, just align rotors and wire stators in parallel. if you don't want to deal with consistency, you would need switching though, or just rectification at least

Ilusys Systems - 2020-12-31

@Neill Coetzer Thanks, I have more videos where I have "improved" design a bit, calculated efficiency and tried to use it as servo motor which was ...meh... :) anyway, good luck with getting off grid!

Neill Coetzer - 2020-12-31

@Ilusys Systems ooooo I'll definitely look into that then since that sounds pretty good

Neill Coetzer - 2020-12-31

@Ilusys Systems yeah thats exactly what I was thinking about. Really cool system

Neill Coetzer - 2020-12-31

@Ilusys Systems looking forward to seeing them. Hehehe thanks man, hope it'll happen

Romualdas Kuzborskis - 2022-04-19

why sisnt you use metal washers as cores for coils ?

Ilusys Systems - 2022-04-19

you can, I was thinking of using magnetic steel shavings as epoxy filler. But, what you get is higher torque at lower speed so power is constant. efficiency likely too if design is good.

Ace Kiwi71 - 2019-02-20

How are you driving this motor with AC?

Ilusys Systems - 2019-02-20

Hall sensor..

Mintu Doku - 2019-01-08

Ahaha....... you always start roting with your hand first...
But there are many people who make rotor without starting roting in hand.... bro make motor that can carry 100 weight

Aimless - 2020-05-20

It doesn't need ESC right? or motor controller whatever you called. I can see only 2 ended of wire in this case you use pulse?

Ilusys Systems - 2020-05-20

In theory you could do it, but in practice you need to control it.
Driver and principle is same as in PC fan motor. it is only a bit scaled and flattened..

Zeeshan M - 2022-04-28

nice thank,s

Yogesh Karkar - 2022-04-12

how much turns and gauge of 1kw motor

Yogesh Karkar - 2022-04-18

waiting for your answer

Lazaro Molina - 2021-11-02

No explicas cuántos voltios , y que tipo de corriente .

mohammad A - 2018-01-25

Interesting Mr Ilusys, How you organised magnets, are they NSNS or NNN or SSS ?

mohammad A - 2018-01-25

also can y ou please share the driver making video as well?

Ilusys Systems - 2018-01-25

It is NSNS. I will make that video. I just need about 2 weeks...

mohammad A - 2018-01-25

So nice of you dear, quick response makes me feel elated, will wait for your video, god bless

Somesh Chaturvedi - 2019-01-26

can we use this type of coil for single phase axial flux alternator

Ilusys Systems - 2019-01-26

Should be OK to do so...

Keith Reynolds - 2019-04-05

Yes

Siddharth Behuria - 2018-05-01

haha when he IP68ed that coil whit that glue thing. Hell, i guess its will pass the IP69K test for sure

ai digital service - 2022-09-01

❤️

Tiger 420 - 2020-07-25

I like it u are ids
Mujhy pasand aya apka triqa

YAKANBO - 2017-08-09

COOL!!! LIKE

Ilusys Systems - 2017-10-17

Thanks!

Alban V - 2017-08-05

So it's a monophase generator right ?

Ilusys Systems - 2017-08-05

yes.
You can use more coils to have more phases.

Master Man - 2019-12-15

good Job

Ilusys Systems - 2019-12-15

thx

Rohit - 2021-06-25

8s it ac or dc