NurdRage - 2015-05-02
Glassware generously provided by http://www.alchemylabsupply.com/ By popular request, how to make Copper (II) Chloride. The first and simplest method is to get hydrochloric acid of around ~20% concentration and add copper. Then bubble air through it using an aquarium pump. The oxygen in the air oxidizes the copper and reacts with the acid to produce copper chloride. Pretty much any concentration of acid can be used, but we recommend around 20% as there are considerably less fumes. A major drawback of this method is that it's VERY slow and can take days to produce useful quantities of copper chloride. The second far faster method is to react hydrochloric acid and copper with an equal volume of hydrogen peroxide. The recommended concentration of acid is greater than 20% and the peroxide is equal or greater than 3%. In our video we used 200 mL 31% hydrochloric acid, 30g of copper and 200 mL of 6% hydrogen peroxide. This reaction only takes a few hours to finish. For many applications like PCB etching or gold recovery from circuit boards, sulfate contamination is not a problem so the third method uses readily available copper sulfate. Just take the copper sulfate and add as much hydrochloric acid as necessary to dissolve it. This directly produces copper chloride that can be used for the previously mentioned application. It will be contaminated with sulfate ions but these have no effect.
Something I've always wondered was could you stabilize Copper (I) Chloride with a complex of some sort and use it for plating copper in a manner similar to Tollen's reagent? If that were possible you'd have a great method to make low cost PCB's on cheap substrates like microscope slides.
That sounds really interesting
add CaCl2(aq) to CuSO4(aq) to get CaSO4(s) and CuCl2(aq)
(CaCl2 salt for de-icing)
Will the video about how to make potassium chlorate via electrolysis be soon? I can't wait to be able to use a bit of electrochemistry!
I'm glad you're back nurdrage. :)
Excellent video, just made up a batch and it worked a treat :)
Can it be used as is indefinitely, or will I need to eventually dilute the mix due to excess copper?
If so, is it just a case of adding more 36% hydrochloric?
I promise to have the crowd funding thing ready by next video. Even if it kills me.
@NurdRage 1:36 isnt that also a super easy way to make H2SO4 ?
NurdRage
If you put a few drops of hydrochloride acid on a pinch of salt will it dissolve the salt leaving a green percepataite?
A yellowish-green one, it forms CuNaCl3*2H2O (Sodium Copper II chloride dihydrate).
I can only find 9% muriatic acid concrete cleaner where I live. Any higher concentrations require license to buy. I am thinking of using the 9% muriatic acid, but how slow is the reaction going to be ? Is gonna take maybe like a week ?
I wanna ask can u get CuCl2 if u do electrolysis of nacl solution with Cu as electrode
Can someone help me out with a reaction as Im really at a loss. So I made CuCl2 by this method and ended up with the dark green solution which was very acidic. I then wanted to make copper carbonate. so to this solution i added solid sodium carbonate which took many additions each releasing CO2 (which took more from excess HCl) When the final addition of sodium carbonate was added, the solution precipitated a brilliant orange precipitate and not blue copper carbonate! The orange precipitate is insoluble and doesn't change colour upon diluting with water. Im sure there were no contaminants in the process and i will repeat it to be sure. Am i missing a simple fundamental of chemistry or have I discovered something? :D Thank you to anyone who takes the times to read this, even if you're just as lost as me.
Maybe you've used copper coins and your solution was made of copper II chloride and iron II chloride (because euro cents and other coins are made of copper plated steel) and when you added sodium carbonate iron III carbonate precipitated
I'm looking for magnetic stirrer, what's the model of that you used in this video?
Hi Nerdrage :)
Your videos have been a fantastic source of entertainment and learning. They have helped me a lot and for that I thank you good sir.
You mention that copper chloride gets stronger as it's used but didn't catch anything about diluting it.
If poss, I'd like to find a suitable strength/etch time that I can monitor and have some spent CuCi2 kicking around which I need to do something about. I then started wondering if it could be used for diluting the solution but wasn't sure.
If not, is it just a case of adding fresh hydrochloric and water?
Just a quick question. Would the reaction in the first method (Bubbling air through the solution) speed up if I used, say, an O2 bottle from an oxyacetylene kit with the regulator JUST cracked open to create a slow stream of bubbles?
I suspect it would, but confirmation would be nice too.
iv used this technique before, with memory boards, its took the copper plating off from under the gold and was able to retrieve the gold fro refining, was a fun process :)
Couldn't you get rid of any sulfate ions by reacting the copper sulfate solution with calcium chloride rather than HCl by causing all of the sulfate ions to combine with the calcium ions and precipitate as calcium chloride.
CuSO4 + CaCl2 = CuCl2 + CaSO4
(aq) (aq) (aq) (s)
Pb and Ba too, for economics problem.....Pb is suggested
Making Copper(II) Acetate solution and mixing in Sodium Chloride also does the trick. Although you also end up with Sodium Acetate, but if you let the solution dry out to form Copper(II) Chloride and Sodium Acetate, you can remove most of the Sodium Acetate and any left over Sodium or Acetate ions through rinsing with distilled water and filter out the Copper(II) Chloride. You will lose a tiny bit of the Copper(II) Chloride, since it is slightly soluble in water, but its a miniscule amount.
It would be cool to see this production method too, since I don't have hydrochloric acid and I don't know where could I get one. I have plenty of table salt and vinegar though.
Maybe you know of some video that shows this process?
Man I love you videos, something about your voice brings happiness and some discomfort.....idk
great video, you can use it to color the fire and pyrotechnics in the next video, thanks
Gold recovery? If you can I'd enjoy seeing a video on that.
Will you finish the video about deactivating etchants? I would be so happy to have a way to throw FeCl3 safely, because i can only trust in your professional opinion.
Greetings from Mexico!
@NurdRage I guess the best way to recycle FeCl3 etchant is to add iron powder, filter and bubble chlorine through it. Oxygen + hydrochloric acid or hydrogen peroxide + hydrochloric acid and sodium hypochlorite + hydrochloric acid may also work. Or try electrolysis.
@Martin of Gliwice chlorine is quite dangerous so its use should be avoided. Fe powder would further reduce Fe(3) to Fe(2). So any addition of reducing agent makes no sence in FeCl3 recycling, the main goal is to oxidise Fe(2). I would choose H2O2 (or air if possible) over NaClO, because You would not have to deal with byproducts (NaCl, Cl2 ). NaClO in acidic conditions with Cl(-) present is not the best idea
@user21XXL ok. I assumed etchant "recycling" means putting completly depleted etchant back to fresh state. Fe powder would reduce copper, since there would be no Fe (III) to reduce and chlorine/bleach/hydrogen peroxide + HCl to oxidise FeCl2 to FeCl3. Although the overall amount of FeCl3 would double each time the etchant is used. But assming Fe(III) presence and no copper extraction, you're right.
@Martin of Gliwice good point, im not sure about Cu part of the depleted etchant, is there a significant diffrence betwen FeCl3/CuCl2 and "pure" FeCl3.
@user21XXL At some point there would be so much CuCl2, and so little FeCl3 in a dm^3 (each time the etchant is recycled, it's volume increase!) that you'd better use it as CuCl2 etchant.
@NurdRage Can the third method also be used to produce Copper chloride crystals provided you evaporate-capture/heat the solution to increase the concentration of copper chloride relative to excess Hydrochloric acid?
Great as always I'd really like to see a video on making electroless nickle and also woods nickle strike keep the great videos coming
Could i possibly use ferric chloride with some copper to make copper chloride, and distill the copper chloride like you said to get hydrochloric acid and the left over copper?
Great video. I am wondering why some people say that etching with Copper Chloride could realese chlorine gas. Is there any real danger of using Copper Chloride for copper and brass etching? If so, when or why these dangers may appear? By overheating Copper Chloride? By adding too much HCl and/or Hydrogen Peroxide when regenerating the solution? By some byproduct or decomposition of the etching process by itself?
Can this substance also be made through electrolysis? I seem to have made a teal powder that is hardly soluble in water by electrolysing copper in saltwater(connected to +). I tried the aluminum foil test and all I got was a discolored mark.
made this in chemistry!
Ah, finally! Thanks! :)
We need more potassium-related videos.
You might want to add "Don't dump undiluted/unprecipated copper solutions down the drain" to the warning disclaimer as copper is quite a potent killer of aquatic life.
Hey mr. Nurd Rage sir,
any chance you could demonstrate photocatalysis and and how it works as a coating for self-cleaning surfaces?
What is the best way to make iron oxide for ceramic glazing?
A strong word of caution! The hydrogen peroxide MUST be 3-6%, otherwise you run the risk of releasing toxic chlorine gas as I did foolishly before, by mixing concentrated hydrogen peroxide and concentrated hydrochloric acid
Hello, I love your channel but I was wondering where you got your stir bar, thanx; )
Can you just boil down the solution to get solid copper chloride?
I (tried to) dissolve 2mol copper wire(127g) in 400ml of HCL (10molar). I've been bubbling it for 3 weeks! It's super dark brown and hasn't dissolved half the copper yet. What should I do?
I was patient to learn chemistry before beginning and even did my own stoichiometry research (I came to the same balanced reaction as you have at 00:34).
Here's a kind of interesting observation I made during the process: After bubbling the solution for a few days or so the HCL remained clear. Giving the bottle a shake would turn the HCL DARK brown, almost black. Letting it sit for 15-30 minutes it slowly cleared up back to crystal clear! So odd.
I've found copper sulphate mixed with calcium chloride (Damp Rid) and filtered works both quickly and gives a pure product. And you avoid acids which is always nice.
so.. how do I dry this using the second method?
My way: i mixed HNO3 and HCl(not aqua regia), u woult want to have a bit more og hno3 at start then u can at hcl as reaction goes, end result is CuCl2+no+h2o
Instead of dissolving Copper(II)sulphate in hydrochloric acid. Why do you not simply make basic copper carbonate, and let the basic copper carbonate react with hydrochloric acid? Sound cleaner to me.
I made copper (II) chloride with the second method, using 3% peroxide, and at first, everything was fine, but after a 3 hours, I noticed that the bottom turned dark brown. If someone knows why did it turned brown, then please tell me how to fix it, or what did I do wrong (maybe that's because I mixed the acid and the peroxide first, then added the copper.
what would happen if you hooked that tube to an oxygen concentrator? During the first process.
Hi, is it possible that what you have produced during aeration is tribasic copper chloride? BTW, can you make a video on producing tribasic copper chloride? Thanks
How about electrolysis instead of the H2O2?
yes I have one question I watched a video on recycling gold and they used copper chloride solution but the solution he was using was a very nice green color compared to the solutions that you make which almost look dark brown what is the difference between the two the lighter one and the darker one love your videos and thank you very much
+James O'Malley mine are extremely concentrated. So the colors are darker. Also, mine tend to also have copper(I) ions mixed in with the more plentiful copper(II) ions. The mixture of ions creates what are called "charged transfer complexes" that are very dark and have a dirty green color rather than a clean bright color. If i added more water to my solutions and bubbled in more air or added more hydrogen peroxide, they would also become bright green.
In the second method, will all the copper disappear by the end of the couple of hours it is stirring?
can you reuse the copper Chloride when it is used
Could you use this to extract the copper coating from pennies? I was thinking of using the copper coating on pennies to form copper chloride, and then precipitate the copper using aluminum wire.
No. HCL reacts with Zinc to make Hydrogen gas and Zinc Chloride. The result will be the opposite and leave you with a hollow penny. HCL doesn't react with pure copper, only copper oxide. So, it would slowly eat a hole through the copper coating as the copper slowly corroded from the oxygen and water. Once it reached the zinc center it would hollow it out.
I only know this because it's a popular science class experiment.
Hi ! im pretty new in the chemistry world and this is one of the first things i wanted to make. My supplies suck but i tried my best. I tried to follow your video, now calculations all by eye xd. Half muriatic acid half hydrogen peroxyde and a chips of copper (from 0,5mm wire). It went pretty fine turning green and stuff. Later that day was Dark Green so i decided the next step would be to evaporate the water (it might have been acid so shi* :p). What happened was something really weird but these are the variables: The recipient was a dirty pot and the temperature was unknown, as it boiled the sides looked a greenish blue and i thought that was good but as it finished boiling it looked really weird. it was bumpy, shiny, and the colour was like a dark green rgb(102, 102, 51) more or less. my teacher described it as an amalgam or i dont know how its spelled XD. i put some water in a sample and dissolver really well. WEIRDER in the bottom was a white salt that dint dissolve.
Next day the sample with the salt that dint dissolve, the water turned kinda yellow. The Pot that i boilled turned dark (i suppose copper oxide?) and some bubbles that were there popped and revealed a solid that looked like copper chloride! (im not sure yet). When i tried mixing it with water, there was some solids in suspension that dint mix (i think it is copper oxide) and the water was brown.
AFTER ALL THIS!!!! does anyone know anything that can help me! XD thx ;)
I can help.
The only thing you need is actually HCL, a power supply, alligator clips, and some copper wire.
You basically want to make electrolysis of copper to get copper chloride in the solution.
What did you drop into the glass to make the stirring?
How will u determine the exact percentage of copper in cuprous chloride...... By instrumental analysis
What if I use a mixture 37%HCl - 75%H3PO4 with 3% H2O2 and add Cu?
I assume that you can use crystallization to purify our copper chloride and get rid of any excess HCl or H2O2
ᴠᴧᴨᴛᴧᴃᴌᴧcᴋ - 2016-09-23
I love how the most asked question on chemistry video's is about the stir bar.